A long discussion about the perception of power -- Coupe V6

[thatchman1]

I've had a lot of Altimas in my day, all of them V6 except an 07 2.5SSL.

02 SE
05 SE
SE-R
02 SE (crashed the SE-R, got an H3, then bought a used 02)
07 2.5SL

And now I have an 09 3.5SE coupe. The CVT in the 2.5SL really seemed to increase the perception of power. That aside, I feel like this is the least powerful V6 I've had, but by the numbers it's the most powerful or at least equal.

Is this the stability control? What else? Any ideas why I'd be perceiving this to be less powerful than my past V6's?

I know in the regular non CVT V6 automatics, the trick to getting the best power was not mashing the gas to the floor, but going about half way, then mashing it the rest of the way a second later. Is there a similar trick for the CVT?

I know perception questions are difficult, and everyone's response is going to be total opinion (assuming you've had both a V6 before and after the CVT). That being said,

Why?



Maybe it's just so smooth that's why it doesn't "feel" fast. I'm not a big fan of using the manushift option-- when I need to mash I don't really know much ahead of time.

Thanks for entertaining this very open ended question.

[rich2342]

It's the lack of torque steer probably..

I had a 3rd gen which felt as though it pulled harder than my coupe, but realistically is probably not true at all. I havent dyno'd this one yet..

[rich2342]

Are you only concerned with the automatic transmissions? I was a 5m/t and now a 6 m/t. But the new CVT's have nothing on the low end. I did not like them at all when I was testing them. The salemen were pushing them on my b/c the 6 m/t are so hard to get..

[thatchman1]

Originally Posted by rich2342

It's the lack of torque steer probably..

I had a 3rd gen which felt as though it pulled harder than my coupe, but realistically is probably not true at all. I havent dyno'd this one yet..

GREAT point. You're probably right. I was never a hater of the torque steer, at least when I was expecting it, and it was rare when I wasn't expecting it.

[thatchman1]

Originally Posted by rich2342

Are you only concerned with the automatic transmissions? I was a 5m/t and now a 6 m/t. But the new CVT's have nothing on the low end. I did not like them at all when I was testing them. The salemen were pushing them on my b/c the 6 m/t are so hard to get..

None of my previous V6's were manual, so yeah I guess I wasn't much interested in comparing other people's perception of a manual vs a manual, or manual vs CVT. You can almost always make a car feel powerful with a manual! but I play with toys in the car too much, too much stop & go driving, so I've never gone that way. Nothing against them though.

[johnmann]

Originally Posted by rich2342

But the new CVT's have nothing on the low end.

I think this is due to the traction conrol, although I squeal the tires without trying quite often. you are right though, once the motor has a chance to wind up it really pushes you back. It's just not instantaneous off the line. I'm not complaining about this, I kind of like the way it does that.

[m_turner_02]

I would venture to say that it is he smoothness of the cvt. with the 5at when you floor it, you feel the downshift and the sudden burst of acceleration whereas in the cvt you don't have that. but in reality, don't the cvt's and the previous gen 5at run almost the same in the 1/4?

[aviatorwes]

I raced a 370z and I actually got him off the line. It was because the traction control slowed him down. I dont know if thats the same problem that you're having but it sounds like it could be.

[thatchman1]

Originally Posted by aviatorwes

I raced a 370z and I actually got him off the line. It was because the traction control slowed him down. I dont know if thats the same problem that you're having but it sounds like it could be.

Another good point. I haven't been able to squeal the tires in this car since I've had it. I almost couldn't avoid it in my other V6's. I may have to spend some more time with the ESC or TCS or whatthehellevernissancallsit turned off.

[kev1n536]

only esc is on the keyboard im typing on. vdc and tcs are the two

[Acct4me]

I actually believe the perception comes largely from the CVT keeping the RPM's up, and out of the max torque range, when you get on it hard. The conventional auto shifts to the next gear, drops the rpm's back to where they rise through your torque curve again, eventually getting back to where the CVT has stayed all along. The torque being what throws you back in your seat, this gives the perception of more power in your standard auto.

[johnmann]

It seems to me as if the CVT in auto mode mimicks the effect of gradually working the clutch on a manual transmission, the rev's stay high when you floor it, there is no way to pop the clutch and make the tires squeal. Then at around 4000 rpm, it really cuts loose. This must be after the TC (torque converter) locks up.

[B15]

I have found the CVT can be quirky at times off the line. My best launches have been from idle and quickly easing the pedal to the floor. Make sure VDC is off because its quick to cut back throttle. I've also noticed that after a few quick/hard take offs, the CVT is much more responsive off the line than if you had been driving sanely.

[johnmann]

you are right, it definately adjusts to how you are driving.

[tooslow_4_u]

Being that i own a manual, and occasionally have driven the CVTs, I think the perception of the CVT is just because its a constant flow of power. You dont feel the sudden increases like you do with the manual. But the manual to me puts down more power and is capable of handling more put to it than the cvt can. To this day, have never come across a CVT Altima that is faster than mine that is N/A