Any vendor who continues to dodge valid questions and turn down an opportunity to have his product tested and gain empirical data from it is not reputable in my eyes.
Yeah, and the website is not really up to standard, IMO. Most of the links were dead and alot of the pictures did not show up. But thats not what i am concerned about.
A)Website is under construction, as explained on front page
B)If I had time to test every product "within your standards" I would love to, but see, there again you don't understand what using products on my own vehicles is all about....
C)I am here to sell quality products, yet YOU all have failed to tell me how the rotors WE sell are shitty, you have proved absolutely nothing SINCE NONE OF YOU HAVE THEM ON YOUR VEHICLES. So my limited "tech" knowledge (or being able to express what I am trying to say) can tell you that AFTER YOU TRY THESE ROTORS ON YOUR CAR, then you have any merit to talk about this particular products.
Data, all you want is data, but I've got something better for you, the ability of my car to finally stop like its supposed to, without squeeling and without taking three hours to come to a halt. That's what this product does....But again, none of you have these rotors on your cars, so how does THAT make you an expert, since any nerd can talk data found on the net, BUT IT TAKES SOME REAL BALLS TO TRUST YOUR LIFE IN A PRODUCT WHICH OTHERS HAVEN'T TRIED OUT....How's that for data? Empyrical? How bout real life?
Originally posted by Cobra I am calling Jesse in a few minutes. Here are the questions I will be asking him. Does ANYONE have a problem with ANY of these?
1. What is the purpose of cross-drilling/slotting a rotor?
2. Does cross-drilling/slotting aid in cooling? How so? How much of an increase in numbers are we talking about?
3. Does drilling/slotting weaken a rotor or affect its lifespan in any way?
4. Are drilled rotors more succeptible to cracks and/or failures than solid rotors of ifentical meterials and construction techniques?
5. Have you ever seen a Brembo rotor of any kind fail (we already know he is lying with this one - hence the next question)?
6. What do you know about the 13" Brembo rotors that came on the 99 Mustang Cobras that have been suffering catastrophic failures?
7. How does a drilled/slotted rotor increase "stopping power"? How does it do this? How much of an increase can one expect?
Does anyone have issues with these questions?
I want you to do this, please. But wait, you already know the answers to these questions, since you've already answered all of them with your knowledge?
Originally posted by Cobra We will answer your questions as soon as you answer ours Alex.
Here is mine . . . which still has not been answered:
How does drilling material from a cast part NOT weaken it?
As stated before I want chemistry here Alex - not some marketing propaganda. Do your homework smartguy. Educate me.
Allow me to reason with you for just one second? Where did I state that it doesn't? Just show me where I said this? There is not a place on this site where I said it wouldn't, as I don't know the answer to that question (I'm not a machinist, just a hands on type of person). Let em ask you a question Cobra....Do you have a Nissan or crossdrilled/slotted rotors by Brembo on the Nissan?
I want you to do this, please. But wait, you already know the answers to these questions, since you've already answered all of them with your knowledge?
I want to know NUMBERS Alex - EMPIRICAL DATA Alex. Since you lack this information I can hopefully get it from the manufactutrers since YOU DON'T KNOW.
Those numbers I want are:
- percent increases in stopping power
- percent increases in cooling
- average decrease in stopping distance
Do you find this request ridiculous Alex? Is it absurd of me to want data? Am I jackass loser because I won't blindly believe the claims of a manufacturer without data supporting it?
So are you agreeing with me that drilling DOES weaken a rotor? Is that what I am to assume you are saying?
Did Alex of SWA just say he agreed with the fact that drilling weakens a rotor?
-or-
Are you just taking the safe ambiguous "middle road"
Quote:
Let em ask you a question Cobra....Do you have a Nissan or crossdrilled/slotted rotors by Brembo on the Nissan?
No to both. So what are you saying? That a Brembo drilled rotor for a Nissan is different than a Brembo drilled rotor on anything for any other application? How is this so?
Originally posted by NissanLunatic B)If I had time to test every product "within your standards" I would love to, but see, there again you don't understand what using products on my own vehicles is all about....
I'm not asking you to. No one asked you to test them. MaddMatt offered to test them. Now step up to the plate and send them out. I'll even give you a deposit on the rotors that you can hold until matt sends them back when he is done with testing.
Quote:
C)I am here to sell quality products, yet YOU all have failed to tell me how the rotors WE sell are shitty, you have proved absolutely nothing SINCE NONE OF YOU HAVE THEM ON YOUR VEHICLES.
Nice of you to ask. But since you didnt, i have used drilled and slotted (both types). I was not impressed with them at all. I did not feel that they improved braking performance over a new set of OE rotors. I have autocrossed and probably driven too fast on the street with both setups, and i have used almost every brake pad compound i've been able to get my hands on.
Quote:
Data, all you want is data, but I've got something better for you, the ability of my car to finally stop like its supposed to, without squeeling and without taking three hours to come to a halt.
A new set of OE rotors would have solved the same problem.
Quote:
That's what this product does....But again, none of you have these rotors on your cars, so how does THAT make you an expert, since any nerd can talk data found on the net, BUT IT TAKES SOME REAL BALLS TO TRUST YOUR LIFE IN A PRODUCT WHICH OTHERS HAVEN'T TRIED OUT
See above statement.
Quote:
How's that for data? Empyrical? How bout real life?
Quote:
Empirical data has many more real life applications that opinions, marketing brochures and "feel".
Originally posted by Cobra I want to know NUMBERS Alex - EMPIRICAL DATA Alex. Since you lack this information I can hopefully get it from the manufactutrers since YOU DON'T KNOW.
Those numbers I want are:
- percent increases in stopping power
- percent increases in cooling
- average decrease in stopping distance
Do you find this request ridiculous Alex? Is it absurd of me to want data? Am I jackass loser because I won't blindly believe the claims of a manufacturer without data supporting it?
Oh no, its not ridiculous at all. First chance I have, I would be glad to test the numbers out for ya (read a few replies before our current discussion)...
You BLINDLY attacked me and the manufacturer, so I can see that you won't BLINDLY believe anything you are told. I already said I don't know (can I stop saying this now, please??), since that part came from my own personal opinion, and that's why let people go for a ride in my car, so they can see for themselves..... How many times do you want me to say it? Huh? For someone who is all knowing, you certainly overlook my explanations...
NOW, MY QUESTION?
DO YOU OWN A NISSAN, AND DO YOU OWN THIS PRODUCT ON YOUR NISSAN?
Originally posted by Cobra So are you agreeing with me that drilling DOES weaken a rotor? Is that what I am to assume you are saying?
Did Alex of SWA just say he agreed with the fact that drilling weakens a rotor?
-or-
Are you just taking the safe ambiguous "middle road"
No to both. So what are you saying? That a Brembo drilled rotor for a Nissan is different than a Brembo drilled rotor on anything for any other application? How is this so?
We aren't getting anywhere, as you are truly blind, and didn't see my reply "that I didn't know".....Cobra, I've said it numerous times, that's why I said "I didn't claim yes or no, since I don't know".....
I'm not asking you to. No one asked you to test them. MaddMatt offered to test them. Now step up to the plate and send them out. I'll even give you a deposit on the rotors that you can hold until matt sends them back when he is done with testing.
[b]
Nice of you to ask. But since you didnt, i have used drilled and slotted (both types). I was not impressed with them at all. I did not feel that they improved braking performance over a new set of OE rotors. I have autocrossed and probably driven too fast on the street with both setups, and i have used almost every brake pad compound i've been able to get my hands on.
[b]
A new set of OE rotors would have solved the same problem.
[b]
See above statement.
Empirical data has many more real life applications that opinions, marketing brochures and "feel".
Again... still dodging the questions.
-Ryan
RJ, I don't have time to play, you guys have wasted more than enough Meg space, you five have taken numerous shots at me, yet I've countered everything. Could you stop asking ridiculous questions now? Thanks..Its becoming a drag, really is...
Just cuz you weren't impressed with them, doesn't mean others don't like them, nor is that data, that's an opinion.
Do you have a Nissan and have used the Brembo crossdrilled/slotted rotors on it?
We aren't getting anywhere, as you are truly blind, and didn't see my reply "that I didn't know".....Cobra, I've said it numerous times, that's why I said "I didn't claim yes or no, since I don't know".....
I'm not blind Alex. I saw your "I don't know" but since you are a VENDOR I find it unacceptable.
Since there is a possibility of these parts failing due to the nature of the design (ie: the drilling) don't you think it might be a wise business decision to FIND OUT or are you not that concerned about it?
The AutoGuide.com network consists of the largest network of enthusiast-owned enthusiast-operated automotive communities.
AutoGuide.com provides the latest car reviews, auto show coverage, new car prices, and automotive news. The AutoGuide network operates more than 100 automotive forums where our users consult peers for shopping information and advice, and share opinions as a community.
Linear Mode
