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  #16 (permalink)  
Old 11-21-2008, 08:32 AM
knowah's Avatar
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I agree but the union has a lot of their reason for failing.
The benefits they're paying those guys are ridiculous. NPR reported that GM spent 5mil+ on viagra benefits alone last year. That is a lot of boners that you and I will be paying for over the next 40 years.

I also blame their reluctance to take a risk on new markets namely:

Compacts (also read cars for the young, making them tunable, as well as cars for the aged)
Hybrids
Fuel efficiency
Quality

Albeit the last one is the alleged aftermath of cutting costs to make up for UAW wages.

I personally think that the companies should have to do everything on their own, if they crash, oh well. If it sends the economy down a spiral, oh well. If our eggs are all in that basket, we kinda deserve it (as a nation not individuals).

Sorry, I'm a bit cynical about the situation.
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  #17 (permalink)  
Old 11-21-2008, 05:43 PM
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The American auto industry never had a chance to compete with the foreign auto industry. think about it...UAW wage = $72ish per/hour vs. American made toyota workers making $32ish per/hour. Way to go union, you priced American made cars right out of competition. I say, let them go bankrupt, restructure, and then go back to producing cars people will buy. Because even though a lot of people have there biases towards foreign produced vehicles, american made cars are still reliable, perform well, and are quasi-stylish...so there is no reason that they should be going bankrupt, except for being priced out of the market by the union
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  #18 (permalink)  
Old 11-21-2008, 06:48 PM
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I hear that $70+/hr number is bullshit.

Either way, just say no to UAW.

Detroit got greedy with their large trucks and SUVs.
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  #20 (permalink)  
Old 11-21-2008, 07:05 PM
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washingtonpost.com
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  #21 (permalink)  
Old 11-21-2008, 09:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m_turner_02 View Post
I think bankruptcy would be a positive result...allowing the car manufacturers to renegotiate the union wages so they can be competitive with the foreign automakers. But I disagree with everyone expecting to get in on the original bank bailout, in the end it is hurting our economy more and more
Considering foreign auto makers use "Guest Labour" (call it slave labour.. it's less ambiguous), allow people to work themselves to death and have a dubious safety record on these shores, the problem isn't with the big 3: it's unfair competition.

Toyota Linked to Human Trafficking and Sweatshop Abuses
Auto Union and Honda Dispute Safety Record at Plants in Ohio - New York Times
http://www.coshnetwork.org/Dirty%20D...%20revised.pdf <-- Honda is #5.
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  #22 (permalink)  
Old 11-21-2008, 09:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kmikl-GAM View Post
Considering foreign auto makers use "Guest Labour" (call it slave labour.. it's less ambiguous), allow people to work themselves to death and have a dubious safety record on these shores, the problem isn't with the big 3: it's unfair competition.

Toyota Linked to Human Trafficking and Sweatshop Abuses
Auto Union and Honda Dispute Safety Record at Plants in Ohio - New York Times
http://www.coshnetwork.org/Dirty%20D...%20revised.pdf <-- Honda is #5.
UAW propaganda.
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  #23 (permalink)  
Old 11-21-2008, 09:51 PM
Ry Ry is offline
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UAW propaganda.
Exactly.
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  #24 (permalink)  
Old 11-21-2008, 10:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ry View Post
I hear that $70+/hr number is bullshit.
could be...I have not researched this, but that is the number that I have been hearing the most of. If I am wrong, my fault for not doing any research
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  #25 (permalink)  
Old 11-21-2008, 10:20 PM
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that was dumb.
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ry View Post
I hear that $70+/hr number is bullshit.
the 70 an hour is factoring all their benefits.. not actual wage.
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  #26 (permalink)  
Old 11-21-2008, 10:24 PM
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the 70 an hour is factoring all their benefits.. not actual wage.
But the number for non-UAW workers doesn't include their benefits, right?
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  #27 (permalink)  
Old 11-21-2008, 10:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ry View Post
But the number for non-UAW workers doesn't include their benefits, right?
Probably not.
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  #28 (permalink)  
Old 11-21-2008, 11:37 PM
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I feel bad for all the people losing their jobs but bailing out these companies is pointless. They need to restructure their business (even if that means falling first) and start making better cars. Otherwise we'll be "bailing out" a company thats going to fail in the long run anyway, and whose going to pay for that? oh yea ...us
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  #29 (permalink)  
Old 11-22-2008, 01:28 AM
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Either way GM will not last after 2009, thats what they get for making a SUV for every letter of the alphabet. They will fall

If all 3 U.S. automakers fall than we are really gonna be in DEEP SH*T
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  #30 (permalink)  
Old 11-22-2008, 02:17 AM
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Originally Posted by Zilveo View Post
I feel bad for all the people losing their jobs but bailing out these companies is pointless. They need to restructure their business (even if that means falling first) and start making better cars. Otherwise we'll be "bailing out" a company thats going to fail in the long run anyway, and whose going to pay for that? oh yea ...us
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